Update: Whatheflock podcast and WTF happened with Kip
One of the episodes I recorded with Chele is available anywhere you listen to podcasts! And a little Tea on Kip's "retirement" and more!
I think this is my first official Justice Justine post, and it just so happens that the first episode of Whatheflock that I appear on with Chele Roland dropped this weekend! Watch it here or listen anywhere you listen to podcasts!
This podcast was recorded just over a year ago, May of 2023. While it’s not technically current, it is still relevant.
Chele and I discuss how we became connected, a little bit of our origin stories, and what we have dedicated our lives to the past year and a half.
Trigger Warning for the podcast
In this episode you will hear some extremely difficult topics, and I completely understand if you do not feel you can listen to it. The truth is, I just listened to it for the very first time and parts were difficult for me to hear. The TRUTH about the ICOC and the ICC is not easy to swallow. While I have been supporting survivors for over a decade, I am not jaded, and I am not hardened, and each survivor story slices my heart open. Sometimes I wish I could form a callus to protect my own heart.
The only other thing I’d like to mention before you do listen is when we discuss how there are lawsuits that have not come out yet, and the monsters that have not been named should be scared. I stand by that, my edit is that not all survivors want to be a part of the lawsuits for various reasons. Whether they want to protect their family, or they are still terrified of their abusers, or they have seen how awful it is for survivors who end up on the witness stand- especially knowing the way we all lived on the receiving end of abuse by our leaders and diciplers. Many of us have had enough of being interrogated and disbelieved.
So, there are monsters who will not be named as defendants in these cases. This doesn’t prove innocence. It proves cowardice.
I think that’s the most important edit. If I think of anything else, I’ll be sure to share.
Kip’s forced “retirement”
In other news, we are still in the Discovery Phase with the lawsuits, which means the ICOC lawyers, the ICC lawyers and our lawyers are sharing information in preparation for a trial. This is a tedious process, but important because the church’s are being confronted with the proof we have.
On the heels of this process beginning, a letter was sent out to the ICC churches from Raul Moreno announcing Kip’s retirement effective immediately, stating that Kip “faltered spiritually”. Naturally, everyone who’s ever been on the receiving end of dicipling the ICOC or the ICC became perturbed as we know if it had been us and our sin, we would have been publicly humiliated and our sin would have been blasted from the pulpit. Why does Kip get to keep his sins a secret?
Well, as you may have noticed, leadership has the privilege of maintaining their status and their sins are kept quiet so that the illusion is not shattered. Sure, we hear these leaders onstage sharing about “past sins”, but at the time those sins were kept quiet. The hypocrisy is never ending in these groups.
Something is not adding up
I was around the last time Kip “retired”, and he wrote a letter to the church, himself. It is extremely odd to me that this retirement was written by Raul, and there was no party, or ceremony. It is also strange for someone to retire suddenly, especially the creator of such a big “movement”. From my experience people set a future date to retire. So, it was clear to me immediately that Kip was forced out of leadership.
At first I thought it was due to the lawsuits, which still may be partially true, but my thought was that through discovery the church recognized that they had to cut ties with Kip due to evidence against him.
The truth comes out
It didn’t take long for the truth to come out… Evidently Ron Harding, known as “the cleaner” came across pornography on Kip’s computer, but it wasn’t just any pornography… it was AI generated with the face of Kip’s former secretary on a porn star’s body. Now, Ron didn’t realize it wasn’t real at first, and brought the evidence to the World Sector Leaders, and eventually brought this sister’s husband into a meeting, where he says, “that’s not my wife’s body”. (You cannot make this stuff up, you guys.) Can you imagine? This is humiliating and violating, and disgusting.
Come to think of it, in the Ten Commandments, does it not say “though shalt not covet another man’s wife”? Yikes, bro.
I cannot possibly tell this story as well as Coltin does, so for the full details check out Coltin Rohn’s explanation of the events. He does a fantastic job of bringing it all together.
The retirement fund
I think it is important to note that Kip did make sure there would be a “retirement plan”, despite his belief that “you only retire when you stop hearing the voice of God”. so, have no fear, your tithe money is keeping Kip nice and comfy in his reFIREment. Meanwhile rank and file members can hardly pay the rent, college students are practically starving and packed like sardines in tiny one bedroom apartments in order to tithe.
Report financial abuse
Oh, speaking of money… if you have experienced financial abuse in the from the ICOC or ICC, please feel free to file a complaint here. Check out Naveh Hall’s recent post:
“To those who have reported aggregious financial wrongdoing: If you want to file a complaint with the IRS, the below is a screenshot of the form to fill out. The form says that if you are afraid you may face retribution if your name is disclosed, you may check the "Anonymous" box. The IRS will investigate these matters.
Here is the link to the fillable form:
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f13909.pdf
With all the whistleblowers who have come forward about fraud, nonpayment, stolen money, lies about Missions, etc, it may be helpful for people to know there is a way to hold the organization accountable 🙏
Praying for All
Ephesians 5:11
⚔️🔥⚔️🔥⚔️🔥⚔️”
Do as he says, not as he does?
Lastly, I have a question for Jason Alexander who specifically mentioned “confronting broken systems, challenging oppressive systems, gossip, slander, sexual abuse. It’s either the evangelism or social justice” in his sermon on June 9th at the 28 minute mark. My question is, if you’re implying that both things need to be happening, doing the right thing as well as evangelizing… then what, Jason are you planning on doing about all of the unreported sexual abuse in your church? I would love to see you lead by example.
I think that wraps up my little newsletter. Feel free to reach out if there’s anythng you’d like me to focus on in future posts.
JUST Justine